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Borodin

Woes Of A Manager...

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Imagine it is just after the Liverpool game and you read these words. Who would you think had said them ? :

"There has definitely been a disconnect between the team that ended last season and started this one," he said. "The lack of belief and lack of quality - it's not just individuals, it's a collective, and it's symptomatic of the season.It was dreadful. We deserved what we got today. I would say this is the lowest point since I have been manager here. This is a real test of adversity and you have to show strength. I want to show strength but I need some support and performances from players.Too many of them have been insipid this season, to say the least. Whatever walk of life you are in you need to have a form of professional pride. Especially at a club like this."

Asked if the players were letting him down he said "Honestly, at this minute I think yes, they are. And they have done for quite a while this season. It's difficult to turn it round. You are looking for motivation, ideas. We have tried different formations. I just think the mindset of some of the players has changed."

It obviously isn't Jose, it's actually the Celtic manager Neil Lennon following their home defeat to St.Mirren yesterday but i immediately thought how applicable these words are to our situation.

We moan about the manager making wrong tactical decisions, defensive attitude, not being motivational etc etc and sometimes miss perhaps the broader picture. No matter what he and the coaching staff try to do if that 'mindset' of some of the squad isn't right then it obviously needs a monumental effort from the people in charge but also the individual players concerned.

For once I felt sorry for Lennon reading the article. It's not someone trying to make excuses for a disastrous serious of results. It's a man wearing his heart on his sleeve and admitting he has run out of ideas but that the players too must also shoulder a percentage of responsibilty for unacceptable performances.

It's easy for the squad members to get in their cars and go back home after a bad result. Whether some of them do feel some remorse or prick of conscience that they could have given more effort I don't know. Whatever they think inside it's Jose who must once again face a barrage of media questions demanding answers as to why the team lost in such a submissive manner.

I'm not saying Mourinho is not culpable for this season's draws and losses but let's not drop the whole blame package on his doorstep. As supporters we want to see them come off that pitch exhausted and having given their all, regardless of the result. That's the minimum to expect of any top professional footballer.

Some blame Jose in here and suggest he is telling the players to 'park the bus' or fall back once a lead is obtained and try to hang on until the final whistle. In actual fact we have no idea of the dressing room discussions that take place but of one thing I am utterly certain. He never ever tells those players "not to try". We would do well to remember that and cut him some slack now and again.

Neil Lennon may well have taken a gun to his head with his press statement but I reckon there are quite a few Celtic  players who's heads were hung in shame and guilt after reading it. Which of ours do you think would feel the same if they had been Jose's words ??

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A brilliant piece of writing Borodin.

The playing and coaching team is a collective. When we are successful, they should share the bouquets and when we cock it up, they should share the brickbats. It should not be 'us and them' - ever.  JM wants to win, so does HK, so does Ledley King and so does Daniel Levy.  They all know their lives would be easier if they were winners and the rewards would also be even higher. The only way that is going to happen is if everyone performs to the maximum level of their ability at all times. Having run a business for 30 years, I know this to be true. We do OK most of the time, but when everyone is fully motivated and committed, the difference is clear to see.

It's difficult for everyone to perform at 100%, 100% of the time, but that is what must be strived for. Look at Man City - a few months ago, all the talk was about Liverpool winning the title and Man City were patchy to say the least ..... now look at them!

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For several years he has been leading the team to win all the domestic trophies. It seems a logical conclusion he wouldn't try to introduce changes which then implies it may be likely to be the players fault.

It is just one more example  throughout Europe that seems to be a normal transgression with all the all successful teams. Mysteriously they lose the plot and lose their magic. No one has been able to stop it happening nor to come up with sensible reasons as to what goes wrong. The only thing that springs into my mind, I have noticed that when the English clubs enjoy a string of successful seasons , they often are quite ruthless. They change 2, 3 or 4 players every summer. Fans often deride players for not loyally sticking to a club, but there is never loyalty shown to players.

Of course, as we don't follow these teams in depth. We don't know if there has been a spate of injuries or being unlucky with wrong decisions going against the team. Or is it complacency and they are thinking they are going to win easily so become sloppy. One thing that often carries some truth is that, when there has been some bad results, confidence can be shattered. It is likely to be more than one thing that has caused the slump which makes things difficult to change.

I think you are right in that it is unfair to put all the blame on the Manager and the players must in some way be culpable at times. The players, quite rightly, will be discussing it among themselves. They may also pass their ideas on to the coaches and manager. That said, sadly for managers, it is their responsibility to find the solution. That is why the only head that will roll and it is the manager's. That's life.

I have sympathy for Lennon in that his illustrious career may end with this season rather than at the very top. However, they can't take his success away from him even though Rangers were a club recovering from working their way back through the leagues. The only detrimental thought I have is that with Rangers out of the picture, the opposition to challenge him was non existent. The same can be said of Rangers when they had their successes.  Between the two clubs they have won the the SPL and Scottish cup most of the time with only the rare occasion another club has somehow managed to stop them.

Of course it is unfair to always blame either the Jose or individual players. The simple truth to what is happening happening on this forum, is that there are two camps. One who wants Jose to carry the can and the other wants for it to be the the players. Jose arrives with history. On the one hand his CV indicated he is one of the most successful managers in the game. On the other hand he has never gone down well well with some and strengthened by his tenure at Man Utd cementing their views. These are emotional reasons for liking or disliking Jose and too often dictate the opinions that are posted on here. On the rare occasion, there are posts made that share the success or blame.

I hold my hands up to being in the dislike camp. I try to be even handed with my opinion but I am more likely to support anti Jose posts than pro Jose ones. But, to be fair to me, the Jose supporters seem to do as I do, that is to support Jose posts and disagree with with the anti Jose posts. That's life. 

COYS

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1 hour ago, Jamesinashby said:

 The simple truth to what is happening happening on this forum, is that there are two camps.

I agree but the real situation is that the problem lies in 'no man's land', that grey area between the two camps where responsibility and accountability are and should be shared. Maybe not 50/50 but certainly a proportion for each. It takes two countries to make a war and it takes management and players to create one within a football club.

Unless the difficulties are looked at realistically and more importantly 'honestly' then a solution will never be found.

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Sporting managers live and die by there decision’s ,,they pick the starting side ,,they train there squads in the way they want them to play .but humans are not perfect and never will be ,,mistakes will always happen ,,but the management’s job is to minimise those mistakes ,,to manage humans ,,not every individual is the same ,,some need inspiration,,,some need gentle encouragement,,,some need a good roasting ,,to get the required affect ,,,

also all managers need to adapt themselves ,,,and not be blinkered into thinking they are perfect 

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It might not be the same ,,,,but Nicky Henderson ( horse racing trainer) has to get his mighty animals to perform,,,shiskin yesterday was off the scale ,,,no mistakes,,only early on maybe ,,but once warmed up he was awesome,,,

horses can’t talk ( funny that ) 

communication in a team sport is crucial,,,it can’t be it’s my way or the high way 

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2 hours ago, Mr8ball said:

Sporting managers live and die by there decision’s ,,they pick the starting side ,,they train there squads in the way they want them to play .but humans are not perfect and never will be ,,mistakes will always happen ,,but the management’s job is to minimise those mistakes ,,to manage humans ,,not every individual is the same ,,some need inspiration,,,some need gentle encouragement,,,some need a good roasting ,,to get the required affect ,,,

also all managers need to adapt themselves ,,,and not be blinkered into thinking they are perfect 

Fair comment, but what happens when we watch the team winning by a slender margin, they appear to decide to try the odd counter attack but mainly hang on grimly until the game ends and concede a goal in the final minutes ?. Sitting on our sofas we bemoan the manager's decision to tell them to play that way and criticise him. Then Jose is interviewed and explains that is NOT what he told them to do and that he too expected them to press forward and get another goal and shut the match down. The supporters then refuse to believe this and suggest he is squirming on the hook and trying to get off with lies. Next thing we know our illustrious striker Harry Kane comes forward and publicly endorses what Jose has said and that ultimately the team carry a weighty responsibility for how they perform out on the pitch once they leave the dressing room.

So let's evaluate that scenario. We go in at half time 1-0 up and Jose tells them to carry on pressing and get a second to seal the win. The team go out and are put under pressure, attacks become less frequent and the whole momentum of the game switches. Suddenly we are under constant attack and managing the odd counter. The mindset of the team changes and there's little the manager can do to get it back from his touchline area.

I will accept the manager is responsible for transfers and team selection, the tactics and the substitutions. I also agree he has to take the role of manager, father,brother and best mate to each player in order to motivate them. It's a massive undertaking for which I also concur they are very handsomely paid. Put as much of the blame on him as you like there will always be a certain element of accountability that falls at the feet of the players.

We have all gone into work some days and thought "I can't be arsed" or been in a despondent mood because of something that's happened at home and allowed it to affect our work levels. These people are human beings also. There is nothing you can do to prevent a player training well and looking fit and hungry all week only to turn up match day in a foul mood over something that happened outside of 'work'. These players are not robots that Jose has unfortunately wrongly programmed for a match. They are well paid professionals who should give 100% for the club and their team mates. I cannot blame them if sometimes they run out onto the pitch and don't have the right mindset but equally I will not just conveniently throw that blame onto Mourinho's shoulders.

Everyone says that Jose only won things because he had some of the World's best players around him. That may be true but I would also contend that those Mega Stars of the footballing World with their inflated egos, mercenary agents and unique lifestyles are probably the most difficult to 'manage' and keep happy. It's a huge juggling act to perform and let us not immedately cry for blood if a ball or two is dropped now and again.

We shall see what changes have been brought about with Harry's absence today and no doubt if we do not win comfortably then the knives will be sharpened and shouts of "Off with his head" heard around the sofas of the UK and beyond. Every fan needs someone to blame when things don't go right and invariably it is the manager who finds himself in the crosshairs.

Just imagine being in a job with ten other guys and deciding you want a new boss. You also know that if you all start under performing then eventually he will be sacked with no direct blame being put upon yourselves. You simply tell the Board Of Directors that you were 'following orders" and return to the dressing room and await your new manager. Now that's what I call a cushy number. The fickle World of football and it's ever hungry, demanding and critical supporters.

I too share the aspirations of everyone in this forum but stand firmly between (as James described it) the two camps. I hold both players and manager accountable and the solution lies in both of them addressing the problems and coming up with answers.

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18 minutes ago, Mr8ball said:

That’s what I am saying the main man jm has to adapt as much as the players a totalitarian situation will never work 

I know mate but I am just trying to point out that as a manager you can try and adapt as much as you like but if the players decide not to comply with your directives out on the pitch (for whatever reason)  then there's very little you can do.:16:.

Look at Celtic, league winners 9 times on the trot. This season same team, same manager and now 23 points behind Rangers. So what has gone wrong ? Has Lennon suddenly forgotten how to motivate each player ? has there been a drastic and obviously negative change in tactics ? have the players suddenly stopped playing to the best of their abilities or refusing to comply to the manager's directives ?

There is obviously a problem and Neil Lennon to his credit has come out and spoken about it openly and honestly. There is just only so much a manager can do, after that he needs the respect, confidence and support of his players. He hasn't suddenly turned into a crap boss and yet performances have dramatically deteriorated.

The supporters may well demand he is sacked either soon or at the end of this season but surely the responsibility cannot lie totally on his shoulders for an inability to adapt ? As fans lets at leas tbe willing to put our hands up in the air and say "It's not all Jose's fault" because if we continue with managerial witch hunts as our sole search for success then it will be many more years before we are consistent title and trophy challengers.

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2 hours ago, Borodin said:

Fair comment, but what happens when we watch the team winning by a slender margin, they appear to decide to try the odd counter attack but mainly hang on grimly until the game ends and concede a goal in the final minutes ?. Sitting on our sofas we bemoan the manager's decision to tell them to play that way and criticise him. Then Jose is interviewed and explains that is NOT what he told them to do and that he too expected them to press forward and get another goal and shut the match down. The supporters then refuse to believe this and suggest he is squirming on the hook and trying to get off with lies. Next thing we know our illustrious striker Harry Kane comes forward and publicly endorses what Jose has said and that ultimately the team carry a weighty responsibility for how they perform out on the pitch once they leave the dressing room.

So let's evaluate that scenario. We go in at half time 1-0 up and Jose tells them to carry on pressing and get a second to seal the win. The team go out and are put under pressure, attacks become less frequent and the whole momentum of the game switches. Suddenly we are under constant attack and managing the odd counter. The mindset of the team changes and there's little the manager can do to get it back from his touchline area.

I will accept the manager is responsible for transfers and team selection, the tactics and the substitutions. I also agree he has to take the role of manager, father,brother and best mate to each player in order to motivate them. It's a massive undertaking for which I also concur they are very handsomely paid. Put as much of the blame on him as you like there will always be a certain element of accountability that falls at the feet of the players.

We have all gone into work some days and thought "I can't be arsed" or been in a despondent mood because of something that's happened at home and allowed it to affect our work levels. These people are human beings also. There is nothing you can do to prevent a player training well and looking fit and hungry all week only to turn up match day in a foul mood over something that happened outside of 'work'. These players are not robots that Jose has unfortunately wrongly programmed for a match. They are well paid professionals who should give 100% for the club and their team mates. I cannot blame them if sometimes they run out onto the pitch and don't have the right mindset but equally I will not just conveniently throw that blame onto Mourinho's shoulders.

Everyone says that Jose only won things because he had some of the World's best players around him. That may be true but I would also contend that those Mega Stars of the footballing World with their inflated egos, mercenary agents and unique lifestyles are probably the most difficult to 'manage' and keep happy. It's a huge juggling act to perform and let us not immedately cry for blood if a ball or two is dropped now and again.

We shall see what changes have been brought about with Harry's absence today and no doubt if we do not win comfortably then the knives will be sharpened and shouts of "Off with his head" heard around the sofas of the UK and beyond. Every fan needs someone to blame when things don't go right and invariably it is the manager who finds himself in the crosshairs.

Just imagine being in a job with ten other guys and deciding you want a new boss. You also know that if you all start under performing then eventually he will be sacked with no direct blame being put upon yourselves. You simply tell the Board Of Directors that you were 'following orders" and return to the dressing room and await your new manager. Now that's what I call a cushy number. The fickle World of football and it's ever hungry, demanding and critical supporters.

I too share the aspirations of everyone in this forum but stand firmly between (as James described it) the two camps. I hold both players and manager accountable and the solution lies in both of them addressing the problems and coming up with solutions.

My word mate that was in depth but also makes me think why wasn't football performance-related with the players it would give them a kick up the ass to put it in Top Gear every game

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2 minutes ago, Craig Truespur said:

My word mate that was in depth but also makes me think why wasn't football performance-related with the players it would give them a kick up the ass to put it in Top Gear every game

Sorry for such a large post but it's something I feel very strongly about..guess I got carried away a bit.

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Just now, Borodin said:

Sorry for such a large post but it's something I feel very strongly about..guess I got carried away a bit.

No mate you vent as much as you want if it needs saying say it. When an intellectual chat right yourself spouts out and rents it just makes us all realise there's a lot more in-depth to football. And I do see myself as quite intelligent but I'll mostly be a monkey in a Spurs shirt throwing my poop around the room kicking furniture later.. Another whether to laugh or cry but when Son scored the other night even though it was disallowed I'll scream with happiness and my kids said Dad can you keep it down please I was disturbing there tick a thing tock...

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It was everybody’s fault when poch was in charge as with all managers,,,mr levy will always get blamed aswell ,,didn’t back him her and everything else .

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My son has just told me that mr Mourinho has had a very long heart to heart with mr Ali,,,to sort out there little problems,,,,that must mean mr levy has had a chat with the coach,,,asking him to sort this out cos there is no money to spend ,,,henceforth the woes of a coach actually listens to his big boss and realising who is in charge 

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